Oldham Options

-------------------------------------------------------------

First Bus Portsmouth Map

For those with a passing or intense interest in First's new network in Portsmouth, Fareham, Gosport and Waterloovillle, the all-new map is available (here). And it confirms that route 0 (zero, read again) was not a joke!

-------------------------------------------------------------

And First is involved, in part, in today's blog. A prize winner no less!

Customer service tested.
Customer patience tested!

Oldham Town Hall

There are three ways to get ftom Oldham to Manchester by public transport: Metrolink tram, First Bus and Stagecoach. fbb's aim was to discover how fares and level of service compared. The aim was to do this from his capacious armchair using either phone or internet. So, as a starter, off go identical emails to the three operators.

The enquiry Tuesday 18th September
Single Adult fare from Oldham to Manchester

Day return fare
Weekly ticket

---------------------------------------------------------------------

Responses Tuesday 18th September

 Metrolink 1 

Thank you for contacting the Metrolink Customer Experience team.

We will respond to your email fully within 15 working days from receipt of your correspondence, if your enquiry is urgent then please contact the Customer Experience team on 0161 205 2000 where a member of the team will be available between 07.00 and 23.00 Monday to Friday, 08.00 and 20.00 Saturday and 10.00 until 18.00 Sunday.

Once again thank you taking the time to contact us.
Kind regards 
Customer Experience Team

 Metrolink 2 

Thank you for contacting Metrolink Customer Services.
We endeavour to respond to your email fully within 15 working days from receipt of your correspondence, if your enquiry is urgent then please contact Customer Services on 0161 205 2000 where a member of the Customer Relations team will be available between 0700am and 2300pm Monday to Friday and 1000am until 1800pm Saturday and Sunday.
Once again thank you for taking the time to contact us.
Kind regards,
Cheryl Hubbard
Customer Services Manager

Why two (slightly different) replies? 15 Working days? Endeavour to reply? To reply to a factual query? Rubbish service.

 Stagecoach Manchester 
Thank you for contacting us. One of our Customer Care Team will respond to you soon.

Soon? Why not straight away? Time will tell what "soon" means.

 First Manchester 
NOTHING

---------------------------------------------------------------------

Response Thursday 20th September

 First Manchester 

Good morning,
The cost of an adult weekly ticket is £18.00, a day saver is £4.50, a single fare will be £3.80.
Thank you for taking the time to contact us.
Kind Regards
First in Manchester
Website Team

First prize goes to First for sending the required information first. And it's the same on-line; which is encouraging.

But no single fares can be gleaned from the interwebnet.

---------------------------------------------------------------------

By Friday 5th October no replies had been received from either Metrolink or Stagecoach; so fbb sent off a gentle reminder. It said, simply, "I await a reply to my query of Tuesday 18th September."

Responses Friday 5th October 

 Metrolink 3 
Thank you for contacting Metrolink Customer Services.
We endeavour to respond to your email fully within 15 working days from receipt of your correspondence, if your enquiry is urgent then please contact Customer Services on 0161 205 2000 where a member of the Customer Relations team will be available between 0700am and 2300pm Monday to Friday and 1000am until 1800pm Saturday and Sunday.
Once again thank you for taking the time to contact us.
Kind regards,
Cheryl Hubbard
 Customer Services Manager

And, of course, they always reply twice.  And, of course, they always reply twice.

 Metrolink 4 
Thank you for contacting the Metrolink Customer Experience team.
We will respond to your email fully within 15 working days from receipt of your correspondence, if your enquiry is urgent then please contact the Customer Experience team on 0161 205 2000 where a member of the team will be available between 07.00 and 23.00 Monday to Friday, 08.00 and 20.00 Saturday and 10.00 until 18.00 Sunday.
Once again thank you taking the time to contact us.
Kind regards
Customer Experience Team

Here we go again; we've been here before, Cheryl (see above), and we're still waiting. Another 15 days? Hope not, it was only a very simple fares query.  But; soon afterwards ...

 Metrolink 5 
Hello Mr White
Thank you for your email. Please accept our apologies for the lateness in replying it would seem that your initial email was missed and for this I cannot apologise enough.
The prices are as follows for tickets from Oldham Mumps to the city centre:
Single adult £3.20
Peak (Monday-Friday before 09:30) adult return £4.80
Off-peak return £3.50
Adult weekly £19.00
To be able to purchase the weekly pass you would have to first become a member of the travel club. This is free to join, application forms can be found on www.metrolink.co.uk in the ticket info and buy online section of the website, alternatively you could take a passport photograph along with proof of identification into a travel shop, where a membership id card will be made while you are there which gives you a unique six digit membership number. This membership number is needed to purchase the weekly, quarterly or annual pass.
Once again thank you for taking the time to contact us and apologies once again for the lateness in replying.
Best Regards
Tom McCormack
Customer Experience Advisor

fbb is somewhat uncertain as to what a "Customer Experience Officer" might actually do. As a retired Omnibological Information Engineer and an unpaid and part-time Exegetical Experience Communicator, and a former Senior Pedagogic Educational Co-ordinator, fbb is somewhat bemused by some of these "vacuous" job titles. Equally baffling is the need to join a free club and be given an identity card and a number ...

... ("I am a free man, I am not a number") just to buy a ticket. Crazy.

---------------------------------------------------------------------

But at least we've got the info. And the last remaining reply?

Still waiting. fbb will try again later this week if nothing materialises. Perhaps write to Sir Brian direct?

Response Monday 8th October (at last!)

Dear Mr White,
Thank you for your email regarding service 76.
I was concerned to read that you do not appear to have had a response from September. This does follow (think you probably mean is "does NOT follow" - fbb) our customer code of conduct which is that we will provide a response as quickly as possible and always within one week. Please accept my apologies for this delay and my assurance that I will be investigating why the this delay has occurred.
The fares you requested are:
Single Fare (adult) - £2.90
Day return ditto - £3.90 dayrider unlimited travel ticket for all Stagecoach Manchester buses
Weekly ticket - £12.00 megarider unlimited travel ticket for all Stagecoach Manchester buses
I trust this information is helpful. If you have any further query please do not hesitate to contact me.
Best regards
Andrew Howard-Smith
 Marketing Assistant

So, after multiple e-mails and  20 (twenty!) days, fbb has the fares information needed to complete his "Contrast and Compare" blog for travel from Oldham to Manchester.

Bet you can't wait?

 Next Bus Blog : Saturday 13th October 

Northampton's Honest Eric

-----------------------------------------------------------

fbb has provoked a bit of debate in his assessment of the poor quality of Travel South Yorkshire's [TSY] leaflets; contrary to promises of "improvement" from David Brown, the head honcho. But the Golden Ilfracombe Bus Station** award must go to First Bus and one of their on-line timetables for the new Sheffield network. Here, in all its mysterious glory, is the mind-numbing extract:-

Four routes (11, 12, 13 and 14), one of them brand new, all shown on the same timetable although their destinations are significantly different.

This highly (extremely high!) simplified fbb diagram also shows that three of the four end in significant loops; all badly shown by First and TSY.

First management must have been on some sort of training course for confusing the passenger and putting people off travelling by bus. There is an argument (not much of one) for showing the 11 and 12 together; TSY thinks they both go to Stannington, which they don't, but surely First's customers would be happier with the disparate 13 and 14 being given separate recognition? For once TSY have made the right decision here. Well done chaps!

But with First, the mind boggles.

** Ilfracombe Bus Station Award?

'Nuff said!

-----------------------------------------------------------

And, talking of First Bus ...

... What's the Betting?

Who will buy my run down First bus company? This is a guest blog by our Northampton correspondent, (with additional material from fbb); and he writes:-

I have spoken to Honest Eric, the bookie at his stall outside St James' depot, and he is offering the following odds.

 10 - 1 
Go-ahead : Seemingly will buy anything at the moment. [fbb] Go-ahead has certainly been in expansionist mood recently; but purchases have usually been independent companies. The exception to that policy is, of course, the ex-First London depot.

 20 - 1 
Arriva : Fits into a hole between Milton Keynes and Leicester. Has experience of running in Northampton, which may discourage them. [fbb] Arriva ran a tendered route from Milton Keynes to Northampton but their recent acquisition history is again with independents (Wardle, Midland).

 25 - 1 
Uno : Would not be surprised to see them start something competing with First before the sale. Could reduce the frequency on 4/4A as they already have 5 buses an hour going to Kingsthorpe; or they might rationalise the whole batch of routes to the north of the town. [fbb] Uno has an operating licence for 30 vehicles, far, far more than are needed for the University job.

 50 - 1 
Centrebus : I suspect they will wait to pick up any tendered work if First does not find a buyer. [fbb] Cenrebus is very widespread; from Luton to Huddersfield; the company (companies) must be difficult to manage but Northampton is close enough to other operations to make it a possibility.

 50 - 1 

Country Lion (based in Northampton) : They have two Optare Solos painted red. Like Centrebus, might wait for any possible tendered work. [fbb] Memory is not that good for detail, but Country Lion was established as a minibus hire operation in late 60s early 70s (?) and subsequently expanded into tendered work and school contracts. This would be a major change of emphasis.

 100 - 1 
Unknown new mystery entrant : What's Julian Peddle doing these days?

[fbb] Answer. Apart from being camera-shy, dunno! His former Status Group empire is all sold off and replaced with interests in Centrebus (see above).

 200 - 1 
Meridian : He can't afford it. Are there that many preservationists willing to sell him their buses to make up his elderly fleet? [fbb] Meridian runs in competition with First on the Kings Heath route in Northampton. If the company had the money, rationalisation would be the sensible option. But ...

 500 - 1 
East Midlands Vehicle Preservation Group : Might muster enough buses for a tendered Sunday route. Most buses not buggy or wheelchair friendly and passengers might be confused by variety of liveries. Possible revenue from enthusiasts. [fbb] A lovely but wholly impracticable idea. Sadly instant bankruptcy would beckon.

Stagecoach have already indicated that their runner has been nobbled by the OFT. [fbb] Of course, if First just pack their cases and go away, there would be no problem for Stagecoach simply to register replacement services. That's what happened in North Devon.

Not very encouraging for any bus passenger living north or south of Northampton town centre.

fbb is putting a fiver on the 25 to 1 option but tempted with 100 to 1. [In theory only; fbb does not bet!]

Watch this space!

 Fat Bus Bloke's Bible Blog looks at Jeans (?) (read here)

 Next Bus Blog : Friday 12th Augst 

Partnership Proposals Promulgated [3]

Continuing the fbb assessment of the publicity for the revised services due at the end of the month under the Sheffield Bus Partnership, fbb looks at the route descriptions that adorn every leaflet.

To help with context, here is a map showing bus services in the Walkley and Crookes suburbs, roughly to the west of the City Centre.

For the record, this map was extracted (but modified) from one of the new network maps as mentioned in yesterdays blog (read again).

Back in the "good old days" bus timetables used to be accompanied by a list of roads (urban routes) and towns and villages (rural routes) to help the passenger. Route 95 has this in 2012:-

 

Notice, first, that this list is entitled "stopping points"; but they are not stopping points by any stretch of the imagination, even an imagination as strange as that emanating from Travel South Yorkshire [TSY] towers. In his meeting last November with TSY boss David Brown and key managers of First and Stagecoach, fbb proffered the opinion that these lists were wholly misleading and thus, not to put a fine point on it, useless.

But everything, fbb was told, would improve under the mutual chumminess of the new Partnership.

So coming up is a full list of "Stopping Places" for route 95 which is shown as an out-and-back timetable because of the big one-way loop in Sheffield city centre ...

... which fbb has amended by adding the stop names to help the passenger understand. Help the passenger understand, TSY? Perish the thought!

 TSY's List of "Stopping Places"   for route 95

Walkley, Tinker Lane,  Bole Hill Road, Walkley Road, South Road, Howard Road, Barber Road, Crookesmoor, Crookes Valley Road, Winter Street,  Bolsover Street, Sheffield Centre,  Gell Street, Glossop Road, West Street, Leopold Street, Pinstone Street, Furnival Street, Paternoster Row, Sheffield Interchange, Flat Street, Church Street, West Street,  Glossop Road, Bolsover Street, Crookesmoor, Winter Street, Crookes Valley Road, Barber Road, Commonside, Howard Road, South Road, Bole Hill Road, Walkley, Tinker Lane

 fbb's thoughts and corrections 

Walkley, Tinker Lane : It's not really "Walkley", see yesterday's blog (read again), but as it has been thus since 1956, maybe the name should be retained. fbb would prefer "Tinker Lane Walkley".

Walkley Road : As there is no equivalent stop in the opposite direction, perhaps this should be omitted from the list?

South Road : Now this should be "Walkley South Road" because this IS Walkley

Crookesmoor : The problem here is the Crookesmoor is a district of Sheffield and by no stretch of the imagination is it a "stopping place". Better would be "Crookesmoor Barber Road".

Bolsover Street : Not wrong, but it might be more helpful to use "Bolsover Street for University"

But what comes next is preposterous.This ...

... is University Square, located, surprisingly, at the University (that's the real one, attended by fbb; not the upstart Hallam thingey). It is not, as described by TSY,

Sheffield Centre : Neither is Gell Street or Glossop Road in Sheffield Centre

West Street : Might just squeeze into the Sheffield Centre category but would be better called "West Street City Hall" as that is the name of the equivalent tram stop.

Then, and only then, do we enter what might be defined as "Sheffield Centre". Do we really need to know that? Isn't it obvious? If not, there is surely a better form of words to communicate the fact that a series of stops is situated in the City Centre.

Paternoster Row : Here the addition of "for Railway Station" would help passengers.

Thus we arrive at our "terminus" in Pond Street Bus Station; sorry Central Bus Station, sorry again, Sheffield Interchange.

And so we set off back to Walkley. Incorporating these changes into the TSY list we get the following with a few emboldened names to aid clarity.

 fbb's List of "Stopping Places"   for route 95

Tinker Lane Walkley,  Bole Hill Road, Walkley South Road, Howard Road, Crookesmoor Barber Road, Crookes Valley Road, Winter Street,  Bolsover Street for University,  Gell Street, Glossop Road, West Street for City Hall, then via the City Centre stops:- Leopold Street, Pinstone Street, Furnival Street, Paternoster Row for Railway Station, Sheffield Interchange, Flat Street and Church Street. Returning to Walkley via  West Street,  Glossop Road, Bolsover Street for University, Winter Street, Crookes Valley Road, Crookesmoor Barber Road, Commonside, Howard Road, Walkley South Road, Bole Hill Road, Tinker Lane Walkley

Which leaves us with one last, unexplained, conundrum. What are "stopping places"?

Buses stop at bus stops, so a list of "stopping places" ought to be a list of bus stops. But in the minds of the TSY creators of the "improved" leaflets, it isn't. Here, for the record, is a list of "stopping places" on route 95, but, to save space and utter boredom, only stops for journeys to the Interchange are listed.

Tinker Lane Bole Hills
Bole Hill Road Rangeley Road
Rivelin Street Bole Hill Road
Heavygate Avenue
Walkley Road
Walkley South Road
Hoole Street South Road
Howard Road Duncombe Street
Commonside Howard Road
Crookesmoor Barber Road
Crookes Valley Road
Winter Street
Bolsover Street for University
Gell Street
Glossop Road
Mappin Street West Street
West Street for City Hall
Leopold Street [C]
Pinstone Street Moorhead [C]
Furnival Street [C]
Paternoster Row for Railway Station [C]
Sheffield Interchange [C]
Flat Street [C]
Church Street [C]
------------------------
[C] = City Centre

Although opinions may differ, for most Sheffielders this ...

... (namely stops around Castle Square) would be "Sheffield Centre". For the service 95, that would include Flat Street and Church Street.

So, TSY, how are your "stopping places" defined?

But, in comparison with previous pre-Partnership leaflets, no change and  No improvement .

 Next Bus Blog : Thursday 11th October 

Partnership Proposals Promulgated [2]

--------------------------------------------------------

A ROBUST REBUTTLE

A suitably anonymous commentator** on yesterday's blog impugned fbb's sense of rectitude and natural justice by implying that the fat and arrogant one was criticising SYPTE unjustly (surely not?) for innocently re-publishing wrong timetables created by the Stagecoach electronic registration system (read again). fbb responded robustly and reminded Mr Nonymous that most Stagecoach printed material shows "loop" journeys correctly; so they have no excuse for promulgating piffle in Sheffield. Here is the "outwards" route 70 timetable ...

... which shows times right round the "loop" from Killamarsh to Norwood. And the return timetable shows the times ...

... right round the "loop" from Killamarsh via Norwood.

As Mr Punch would say with squeaky voice, "That's the way to do it!". And on their version of the 70 leaflet, guess what, SYPTE gets it wrong!

** Perhaps A. Nonymous is SYPTE's Director-in-chief, David Brown?

 --------------------------------------------------------

fbb is looking at the improvements in publicity promised by Sheffield bigwigs as a consequence of the impressive (?) Sheffield Bus Partnership in which First and Stagecoach are "working together to provide a better bus service for the people of Sheffield." Maybe, maybe not; but fbb is checking on the supposedly "new-look" on-line and printed timetable leaflets. One on-going complaint, and not just from the corpulent one has been:-

 Misleading maps   e.g. service 42

We  were left, yesterday, with the challenge of understanding the route of service 42 from the excellent map (!) produced by expensive software supplied by Swedish firm Kartor.

Don't worry, the Sheffield ones are in English!

The software is "ideal", say its promoters, because it is all created automatically from one central database.  It is that automated process that produces the 42 map shown above; which our readers are challenged to understand.

Don't bother, it's not worth the effort; fbb will explain all. The 42 via the snappily titled Normanton Spring, Normanton Spring Road, Normanton Grove is a schooldays only diversion, formerly a separate service numbered 41. Then the extra bit shown north of Waterthorpe is the 0523 from Sheffield to Crystal Peaks.
 Confusing   and   no improvement   

Now a "proper" map would make those exceptional journeys clear by using (say) dotted lines and adding an explanatory note alongside the very occasional diversions. Here's one fbb made earlier:-

And, just for the record, apart from a couple of early morning trips, the all-day service 42 does NOT serve Waterthorpe.  That is simply  WRONG . Crystal Peaks is not Waterthorpe; Crystal Peaks is Crystal Peaks shopping centre; Waterthorpe is Waterthorpe.

The dowloaded Kartor file is just too memory hungry and unmanageable for fbb to do anything better, but an extract from fbb's network map may help.

At least it's got a few road names. When the "Partnership" was announced, fbb offered to produce route maps that were, well, useful; but his offer was politely but firmly declined. What is particularly galling is that boss DB told fbb that Stagecoach would be providing brand new maps via their own supplier (that's FWT).

Perhaps the boss was confused, (no wonder with maps like the current ones!), but the really good news (yes there is some!) is that we will have two new all-operator network maps at last. These are now available on-line and they are magnificent.

They appear to be accurate at first glance, but reasonably well-hidden in the depths of the TSY web site. They are so different from the poor quality of the cartography on the leaflets. It should not be difficult to simply extract the lines, road names and route numbers for each service from the big maps and jiggle them to create an equally good presentation for every timetable leaflet. But, of course, that can't be done; it's not "automatic".

Generally, apart from the new super-maps, there has been no improvement in printed and on-line publicity as a result of the much-vaunted "Partnership". Perhaps we had better offer a slightly more positive angle on all this. The PTE has only had about 9 months to get this sorted, so doing anything different from "normal" may have been quite beyond them in such a short timescale. Cynical, moi?

 And there's more ...

 Appalling routedescriptions   e.g. service 95

Route 95 to Walkley dates from horse tram days. When the electric trams were withdrawn in 1956, the bus route followed the old tram tracks, terminating in a little turning loop via "back streets" at Walkley Library on South Road.

Unhampered by the need for overhead and rails, part of the service was extended along Bole Hill Road to a terminus at what Sheffield Transport called Walkley Tinker Lane.

For reasons only known to the designers of this modern TSY map, there is no label for the main (South Road) Walkley stop which is indicated by the two minuscule dots below the "B" of Bole Hill Road.

Had Sheffield Transport called the new terminus "Bole Hills Tinker Lane" in the first place, at least some of the data management problems perpetrated by Travel South Yorkshire [TSY] would have been avoided. Tinker Lane is not Walkley and never has been; even Transport Defunct calls it "Crookes"; which it isn't.

So when the TSY leaflet bravely announces ...

... we can be sure that there will be a credibility gap of substantial proportions. This problem has been another of fbb's perennial moans, supported by many other correspondents who have contacted TSY about the eternal labelling nonsense. So has it got any better under the "Partnership", as promised?

Tomorrow we look in detail at the route 95 information. Before that, we enjoy a picture of a tram on its way from the South Road terminus to City in (?) the early 1900s. Electric trams started in 1899.

In fact, it hasn't changed much at all!

Fat Bus Bloke's Bible Blog examines the "Einstein epistle" (read here)

 Next Bus Blog : Wednesday 10th October